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Wed, 09 Jan 2019 04:21:02 -0800

Here's my 2c:
Calling gay people "subhuman" is so vile that needs direct action from
outside of the wiki but IMO this is a symptom of a larger issue.

The issue is that different wikis are disconnected and don't have proper
oversight by a central (volunteer-based) authority.
This sometimes lead to different languages having biases that are related
to the culture and this is sorta okay-ish specially if the wiki is big
enough to balance the differences. Let me give you several examples:
* In Arabic Wikipedia name of the water body south of Iran/North of UAE is
"Arabian gulf" but in Persian Wikipedia is "Persian gulf". This basically
means different versioning of the same entity. I don't like this because
what makes Wikipedia great is that you don't get personalized articles,
like article of "Abortion" in English Wikipedia is the same regardless of
what your stand on this matter is. This differentiates Wikipedia from
facebook and twitter that put people in bubbles.
* In smaller wikis the issue gets worse. What bothered me for a very long
time was that article of "Mohammad" was "Mohammad peace be upon him" [1]
until 27 March of 2018 [2]. When the title is so biased towards the
religious point of view, how neutral the article itself is?
* The issue can different shapes too. I can find lots of
copyright-violating pictures in small wikis. Most of these pictures are
copyright violation [3] We have global sysops and SWMT but it's more of a
reactionary mentality.
* Language barrier makes things even harder. Just imagine how harder it
would be to react if the above discussion happened in Amharic instead of
English.

Maybe it's more a feature than a bug. For example, in Persian Wikipedia
several articles in controversial topics that are featured (homosexuality,
and some articles about Baha'i's faith) are not being used in the main page
to avoid controversy and blockade of Wikipedia in Iran. As the person who
wrote most of one of those articles, I disagree but I understand and
respect the community's decision.

I just want to point out to the issue and I have no solutions. Stewards
seem like a good fit to apply fleet-side norms like no discrimination
policy.

Also, I don't have anything against mzn and urwikis, these are happen to
languages that I have basic understanding of.
[1]: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Peace_be_upon_him
[2]:
https://ur.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=%D8%AE%D8%A7%D8%B5:%D9%86%D9%88%D8%B4%D8%AA%DB%81&page=%D9%85%D8%AD%D9%85%D8%AF+%D8%A8%D9%86+%D8%B9%D8%A8%D8%AF+%D8%A7%D9%84%D9%84%DB%81&uselang=en
[3]:
https://mzn.wikipedia.org/wiki/%D8%B4%D8%A7:%D8%AA%D8%B5%D8%A7%D9%88%DB%8C%D8%B1_%D8%AC%D8%AF%DB%8C%D8%AF

Sorry for the long email.

On Mon, Jan 7, 2019 at 6:53 PM Vi to <vituzzu.w...@gmail.com> wrote:

> By the way, please do not intervene en masse. They (the user involved) have
> a strong tendency towards using "colonialism" as a general purpose excuse
> for their action, as I experienced myself a bunch of months ago, along with
> a series of references to Italian invasion of Ethiopia.
> This kind of excuse is easily is fed by this kind of intervention. Talkpage
> contents is a trivial matter compared to insults and abuse of
> administrative privileges. While the latter one is solved the first one is
> yet to be handled.
>
> Vito
>
> Il giorno lun 7 gen 2019 alle ore 15:56 James Heilman <jmh...@gmail.com>
> ha
> scritto:
>
> > While we give individual languages / projects a great deal of autonomy,
> > they are not completely autonomous and remain accountable to our global
> > norms. We have a shared brand to uphold. Glad to see a strong position
> has
> > been taken by the community against discrimination based on sexual
> > orientation.
> >
> > My 2 cents
> > James
> >
> > On Mon, Jan 7, 2019 at 6:39 AM Ariel Glenn WMF <ar...@wikimedia.org>
> > wrote:
> >
> > > A note that the user's talk page
> > >
> > >
> >
> https://am.wikipedia.org/wiki/%E1%8A%A0%E1%89%A3%E1%88%8D_%E1%8B%8D%E1%8B%AD%E1%8B%AD%E1%89%B5:Codex_Sinaiticus
> > > may or may not reflect all of the comments made at any given moment,
> > since
> > > the user has been engaged in deleting large parts of the discussion.
> > You'll
> > > want to double-check the history to see what's been written.
> > > _______________________________________________
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> >
> >
> > --
> > James Heilman
> > MD, CCFP-EM, Wikipedian
> > _______________________________________________
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-- 
Amir
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